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Okay, Rowan talked me into this (Hi, Rowan!) Still not sure why anyone would want to read my thoughts.

Oh well.

So why am I in a bad mood? I'm in a bad mood due to being far too attached to the Whedonverse.

To be more specific, I'm far too attached to the character of Spike. . .who happens to be the Whedonverse's favorite kick-toy.

So what's the angst du jour? Spike as "ghost."



It's not that "Spike as ghost" cannot work on any level. It could. The problem is that I don't trust Mutant Enemy to make it work. I don't trust why Mutant Enemy chose to go with this concept. I don't trust Mutant Enemy.

The only way that "Spike as ghost" works is as an answer for "what does the character want?" My friend Barb pointed out that this is the problem with resurrection plots. You have someone do the big, noble sacrifice bit and the journey is over. If you bring them back, what do they want? By bringing him back as a ghost there's a quick and simple answer to this--he doesn't want to be a ghost! So on that level the ghost plot works. The audience has a quick and easy "in" to the character. Who would want to be a ghost? It has to be a special slice of hell to be in this world but not part of it, to be unable to taste, touch, or feel. If this was part of some romantic plot where there was a love interest and that was the angst/obstacle to the relationship, maybe it could work. . . maybe.

However, now we're back to why I distrust Mutant Enemy and their motives for making this choice. I do not believe they made this choice based on the best interest of the character of Spike. I do not believe they did this because it would be a good, visceral "in" to the character. I believe they did this because Joss was bored and he had thought up this "ghost" thing for the Eliza Dushku project that is never going to happen (just as that Firefly movie is never going to happen so Mr. Joss --I am God--Whedon really needs to get over it). And I believe David Fury was sitting around thinking that there had to be a way to keep Spike "in his place" so that Spike wouldn't threaten the super-special-must-be-protected-at-all-costs Angelkins. The ghost thing manages to marginalize Spike on all levels. He can't possibly morph into a protagonist because he has no freedom of movement, no existence outside of Angel's presence therefore there's no danger that he might be seen as usurping Angel even the tiniest bit. He also can't be seen as a bigger draw of the female demographics because as an incorporeal being, Spike is effectively neutered. Speaking of which, this also keeps Whedon from ever having to pay off Spuffy (not that I thought that was ever going to happen anyway) but this gives yet another reason why. Spike can continue to be Buffy's adoring slave even when she's not on screen. However (and this has to be the big lure of this) while allowing Spike to continue being the loving fool, it also completely neutralizes him as potential Angel rival. Sure, Angel may be a eunoch what with the curse and all, but at least he's corporeal!

This is what makes me sick about the whole thing. I was resigned to Spike getting the short end of the stick. I just thought that Mutant Enemy might try to pacify the Spike fans by allowing him to move on from Buffy and find a relationship elsewhere. That would have been a way to clear the way for the long dead and moldering corpse of "B/A 4 eva!" to still pay off for the hearty souls who still cling to that dead plot. But, no, ME has to stick with the "having their cake and eating it too" philosophy. They may have no intention of every paying Spuffy off in any way, but that doesn't mean they're above continuing to keep die-hard Spuffies hanging on.

If I had my dream plot come true. Spike would be corporeal. Angel would fall for Eve. Someone would fall for Spike. Spike would start to give a new relationship a chance. Buffy would show up and find out that while her cookies were baking her two vamps went out and got LIVES!

Of course, that defeats the ME strategy of never allowing things to be over when they should be over. Reading the sides, I'm left feeling that Spike has become what Rowan coined as "Angel's Butt Cricket" (That would be a cross between Angel's Butt Monkey and Angel's Jimminy Cricket... who in the book also happened to be a ghost). What I foresee is poor Spike forced to play Angel's ButtCricket and (horror of all horrors) enact some "Topper" meets Stephen Spielberg's "Always."



At least even as a ghost Cary Grant had a love interest.

So, I'm ticked off.

Ticked off. Pissed. Angry. Emotionally exhausted by Mutant Enemy.

I think Barb summed it up for me yesterday:

C.S. Lewis said that the reward for accomplishing a difficult task is to be given an even more difficult task, and that's cool. But I'm more interested in viewer rewards.

Example: In season five, Spike wanted to get the chip out, and he wanted Buffy to love him. He got neither of the rewards he was seeking. However, he did earn Buffy's respect and trust and Dawn's friendship, and began taking the first steps towards regaining his humanity. Spike didn't get what he wanted, but the viewers were rewarded by seeing Spike get something which was actually more important and valuable.

I think S6 and S7 were supposed to be like this, too, and we were supposed to see Spike's regaining his soul, and his ultimate sacrifice, as being more important than gaining Buffy's love. In some senses, they were, and some viewers found this a satisfactory conclusion. But for a lot of people, they weren't, because the more saintly Spike gets, the farther removed he is from most of us. Almost everyone can identify with unrequited love. Fewer of us can identify with Spike/William's soul-deep desire to be consumed in something grander and more glorious than himself, something which ultimately removes him entirely from human concerns. Spike's gone beyond the need for mere human love or validation in his final moments, caught up in a near-religious warrior's rapture--and once that's over, like Buffy, all he wants is to rest. I can stand aside and say yes, this is very much in character for death-glory-and-sod-all-else Spike, but this is not really a state I can understand or empathize with on a gut level. Spike's died a hero, and I should be glad, but I'm paralyzed with the sense ME took the easy way out. And on an intellectual level, I find his death more depressing than uplifting.

And along the way, smaller moments of potential payoff were robbed of their impact, e.g. the removal of the chip. By the time Spike got it out, it had been rendered dramatically irrelevant. By the time Buffy gave Spike her trust and maybe her love, poor stunted thing that it was, I no longer cared about Buffy. Even large ones, like the soul, were completely undercut and often ignored. A payoff is only a payoff if the currency is good. I can win ten million bubblegum cards, and it may be the biggest bubblegum card payoff in the history of the universe, but you know, I'd rather have fifty bucks.

So it's not necessarily that I want Spike to get prezzies. It's that I want to get prezzies. I’m tired of watching torture, loss, rejection, and death. I want to see Spike accomplish something, even if it's not what he thinks he wants. I feel as if ME has been dangling a carrot in front of me for two years. I realize I have to keep running to make the system work, but sometimes I just want the damn carrot. Just a taste. Or fifty bucks. Instead, I have a sneaking suspicion that the fishing pole is just getting longer.

Actually, I feel like they just flung the carrot across a stadium.

(no subject)

Okay, Rowan talked me into this (Hi, Rowan!) Still not sure why anyone would want to read my thoughts.

Oh well.

So why am I in a bad mood? I'm in a bad mood due to being far too attached to the Whedonverse.

To be more specific, I'm far too attached to the character of Spike. . .who happens to be the Whedonverse's favorite kick-toy.

So what's the angst du jour? Spike as "ghost."



It's not that "Spike as ghost" cannot work on any level. It could. The problem is that I don't trust Mutant Enemy to make it work. I don't trust why Mutant Enemy chose to go with this concept. I don't trust Mutant Enemy.

The only way that "Spike as ghost" works is as an answer for "what does the character want?" My friend Barb pointed out that this is the problem with resurrection plots. You have someone do the big, noble sacrifice bit and the journey is over. If you bring them back, what do they want? By bringing him back as a ghost there's a quick and simple answer to this--he doesn't want to be a ghost! So on that level the ghost plot works. The audience has a quick and easy "in" to the character. Who would want to be a ghost? It has to be a special slice of hell to be in this world but not part of it, to be unable to taste, touch, or feel. If this was part of some romantic plot where there was a love interest and that was the angst/obstacle to the relationship, maybe it could work. . . maybe.

However, now we're back to why I distrust Mutant Enemy and their motives for making this choice. I do not believe they made this choice based on the best interest of the character of Spike. I do not believe they did this because it would be a good, visceral "in" to the character. I believe they did this because Joss was bored and he had thought up this "ghost" thing for the Eliza Dushku project that is never going to happen (just as that Firefly movie is never going to happen so Mr. Joss --I am God--Whedon really needs to get over it). And I believe David Fury was sitting around thinking that there had to be a way to keep Spike "in his place" so that Spike wouldn't threaten the super-special-must-be-protected-at-all-costs Angelkins. The ghost thing manages to marginalize Spike on all levels. He can't possibly morph into a protagonist because he has no freedom of movement, no existence outside of Angel's presence therefore there's no danger that he might be seen as usurping Angel even the tiniest bit. He also can't be seen as a bigger draw of the female demographics because as an incorporeal being, Spike is effectively neutered. Speaking of which, this also keeps Whedon from ever having to pay off Spuffy (not that I thought that was ever going to happen anyway) but this gives yet another reason why. Spike can continue to be Buffy's adoring slave even when she's not on screen. However (and this has to be the big lure of this) while allowing Spike to continue being the loving fool, it also completely neutralizes him as potential Angel rival. Sure, Angel may be a eunoch what with the curse and all, but at least he's corporeal!

This is what makes me sick about the whole thing. I was resigned to Spike getting the short end of the stick. I just thought that Mutant Enemy might try to pacify the Spike fans by allowing him to move on from Buffy and find a relationship elsewhere. That would have been a way to clear the way for the long dead and moldering corpse of "B/A 4 eva!" to still pay off for the hearty souls who still cling to that dead plot. But, no, ME has to stick with the "having their cake and eating it too" philosophy. They may have no intention of every paying Spuffy off in any way, but that doesn't mean they're above continuing to keep die-hard Spuffies hanging on.

If I had my dream plot come true. Spike would be corporeal. Angel would fall for Eve. Someone would fall for Spike. Spike would start to give a new relationship a chance. Buffy would show up and find out that while her cookies were baking her two vamps went out and got LIVES!

Of course, that defeats the ME strategy of never allowing things to be over when they should be over. Reading the sides, I'm left feeling that Spike has become what Rowan coined as "Angel's Butt Cricket" (That would be a cross between Angel's Butt Monkey and Angel's Jimminy Cricket... who in the book also happened to be a ghost). What I foresee is poor Spike forced to play Angel's ButtCricket and (horror of all horrors) enact some "Topper" meets Stephen Spielberg's "Always."



At least even as a ghost Cary Grant had a love interest.

So, I'm ticked off.

Ticked off. Pissed. Angry. Emotionally exhausted by Mutant Enemy.

I think Barb summed it up for me yesterday:

C.S. Lewis said that the reward for accomplishing a difficult task is to be given an even more difficult task, and that's cool. But I'm more interested in viewer rewards.

Example: In season five, Spike wanted to get the chip out, and he wanted Buffy to love him. He got neither of the rewards he was seeking. However, he did earn Buffy's respect and trust and Dawn's friendship, and began taking the first steps towards regaining his humanity. Spike didn't get what he wanted, but the viewers were rewarded by seeing Spike get something which was actually more important and valuable.

I think S6 and S7 were supposed to be like this, too, and we were supposed to see Spike's regaining his soul, and his ultimate sacrifice, as being more important than gaining Buffy's love. In some senses, they were, and some viewers found this a satisfactory conclusion. But for a lot of people, they weren't, because the more saintly Spike gets, the farther removed he is from most of us. Almost everyone can identify with unrequited love. Fewer of us can identify with Spike/William's soul-deep desire to be consumed in something grander and more glorious than himself, something which ultimately removes him entirely from human concerns. Spike's gone beyond the need for mere human love or validation in his final moments, caught up in a near-religious warrior's rapture--and once that's over, like Buffy, all he wants is to rest. I can stand aside and say yes, this is very much in character for death-glory-and-sod-all-else Spike, but this is not really a state I can understand or empathize with on a gut level. Spike's died a hero, and I should be glad, but I'm paralyzed with the sense ME took the easy way out. And on an intellectual level, I find his death more depressing than uplifting.

And along the way, smaller moments of potential payoff were robbed of their impact, e.g. the removal of the chip. By the time Spike got it out, it had been rendered dramatically irrelevant. By the time Buffy gave Spike her trust and maybe her love, poor stunted thing that it was, I no longer cared about Buffy. Even large ones, like the soul, were completely undercut and often ignored. A payoff is only a payoff if the currency is good. I can win ten million bubblegum cards, and it may be the biggest bubblegum card payoff in the history of the universe, but you know, I'd rather have fifty bucks.

So it's not necessarily that I want Spike to get prezzies. It's that I want to get prezzies. I’m tired of watching torture, loss, rejection, and death. I want to see Spike accomplish something, even if it's not what he thinks he wants. I feel as if ME has been dangling a carrot in front of me for two years. I realize I have to keep running to make the system work, but sometimes I just want the damn carrot. Just a taste. Or fifty bucks. Instead, I have a sneaking suspicion that the fishing pole is just getting longer.

Actually, I feel like they just flung the carrot across a stadium.

(no subject)

Okay, Rowan talked me into this (Hi, Rowan!) Still not sure why anyone would want to read my thoughts.

Oh well.

So why am I in a bad mood? I'm in a bad mood due to being far too attached to the Whedonverse.

To be more specific, I'm far too attached to the character of Spike. . .who happens to be the Whedonverse's favorite kick-toy.

So what's the angst du jour? Spike as "ghost."



It's not that "Spike as ghost" cannot work on any level. It could. The problem is that I don't trust Mutant Enemy to make it work. I don't trust why Mutant Enemy chose to go with this concept. I don't trust Mutant Enemy.

The only way that "Spike as ghost" works is as an answer for "what does the character want?" My friend Barb pointed out that this is the problem with resurrection plots. You have someone do the big, noble sacrifice bit and the journey is over. If you bring them back, what do they want? By bringing him back as a ghost there's a quick and simple answer to this--he doesn't want to be a ghost! So on that level the ghost plot works. The audience has a quick and easy "in" to the character. Who would want to be a ghost? It has to be a special slice of hell to be in this world but not part of it, to be unable to taste, touch, or feel. If this was part of some romantic plot where there was a love interest and that was the angst/obstacle to the relationship, maybe it could work. . . maybe.

However, now we're back to why I distrust Mutant Enemy and their motives for making this choice. I do not believe they made this choice based on the best interest of the character of Spike. I do not believe they did this because it would be a good, visceral "in" to the character. I believe they did this because Joss was bored and he had thought up this "ghost" thing for the Eliza Dushku project that is never going to happen (just as that Firefly movie is never going to happen so Mr. Joss --I am God--Whedon really needs to get over it). And I believe David Fury was sitting around thinking that there had to be a way to keep Spike "in his place" so that Spike wouldn't threaten the super-special-must-be-protected-at-all-costs Angelkins. The ghost thing manages to marginalize Spike on all levels. He can't possibly morph into a protagonist because he has no freedom of movement, no existence outside of Angel's presence therefore there's no danger that he might be seen as usurping Angel even the tiniest bit. He also can't be seen as a bigger draw of the female demographics because as an incorporeal being, Spike is effectively neutered. Speaking of which, this also keeps Whedon from ever having to pay off Spuffy (not that I thought that was ever going to happen anyway) but this gives yet another reason why. Spike can continue to be Buffy's adoring slave even when she's not on screen. However (and this has to be the big lure of this) while allowing Spike to continue being the loving fool, it also completely neutralizes him as potential Angel rival. Sure, Angel may be a eunoch what with the curse and all, but at least he's corporeal!

This is what makes me sick about the whole thing. I was resigned to Spike getting the short end of the stick. I just thought that Mutant Enemy might try to pacify the Spike fans by allowing him to move on from Buffy and find a relationship elsewhere. That would have been a way to clear the way for the long dead and moldering corpse of "B/A 4 eva!" to still pay off for the hearty souls who still cling to that dead plot. But, no, ME has to stick with the "having their cake and eating it too" philosophy. They may have no intention of every paying Spuffy off in any way, but that doesn't mean they're above continuing to keep die-hard Spuffies hanging on.

If I had my dream plot come true. Spike would be corporeal. Angel would fall for Eve. Someone would fall for Spike. Spike would start to give a new relationship a chance. Buffy would show up and find out that while her cookies were baking her two vamps went out and got LIVES!

Of course, that defeats the ME strategy of never allowing things to be over when they should be over. Reading the sides, I'm left feeling that Spike has become what Rowan coined as "Angel's Butt Cricket" (That would be a cross between Angel's Butt Monkey and Angel's Jimminy Cricket... who in the book also happened to be a ghost). What I foresee is poor Spike forced to play Angel's ButtCricket and (horror of all horrors) enact some "Topper" meets Stephen Spielberg's "Always."



At least even as a ghost Cary Grant had a love interest.

So, I'm ticked off.

Ticked off. Pissed. Angry. Emotionally exhausted by Mutant Enemy.

I think Barb summed it up for me yesterday:

C.S. Lewis said that the reward for accomplishing a difficult task is to be given an even more difficult task, and that's cool. But I'm more interested in viewer rewards.

Example: In season five, Spike wanted to get the chip out, and he wanted Buffy to love him. He got neither of the rewards he was seeking. However, he did earn Buffy's respect and trust and Dawn's friendship, and began taking the first steps towards regaining his humanity. Spike didn't get what he wanted, but the viewers were rewarded by seeing Spike get something which was actually more important and valuable.

I think S6 and S7 were supposed to be like this, too, and we were supposed to see Spike's regaining his soul, and his ultimate sacrifice, as being more important than gaining Buffy's love. In some senses, they were, and some viewers found this a satisfactory conclusion. But for a lot of people, they weren't, because the more saintly Spike gets, the farther removed he is from most of us. Almost everyone can identify with unrequited love. Fewer of us can identify with Spike/William's soul-deep desire to be consumed in something grander and more glorious than himself, something which ultimately removes him entirely from human concerns. Spike's gone beyond the need for mere human love or validation in his final moments, caught up in a near-religious warrior's rapture--and once that's over, like Buffy, all he wants is to rest. I can stand aside and say yes, this is very much in character for death-glory-and-sod-all-else Spike, but this is not really a state I can understand or empathize with on a gut level. Spike's died a hero, and I should be glad, but I'm paralyzed with the sense ME took the easy way out. And on an intellectual level, I find his death more depressing than uplifting.

And along the way, smaller moments of potential payoff were robbed of their impact, e.g. the removal of the chip. By the time Spike got it out, it had been rendered dramatically irrelevant. By the time Buffy gave Spike her trust and maybe her love, poor stunted thing that it was, I no longer cared about Buffy. Even large ones, like the soul, were completely undercut and often ignored. A payoff is only a payoff if the currency is good. I can win ten million bubblegum cards, and it may be the biggest bubblegum card payoff in the history of the universe, but you know, I'd rather have fifty bucks.

So it's not necessarily that I want Spike to get prezzies. It's that I want to get prezzies. I’m tired of watching torture, loss, rejection, and death. I want to see Spike accomplish something, even if it's not what he thinks he wants. I feel as if ME has been dangling a carrot in front of me for two years. I realize I have to keep running to make the system work, but sometimes I just want the damn carrot. Just a taste. Or fifty bucks. Instead, I have a sneaking suspicion that the fishing pole is just getting longer.

Actually, I feel like they just flung the carrot across a stadium.