De-Evolution of Angel
Dec. 13th, 2010 10:49 am![[personal profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png){kind=small}
shipperx:
So, I'm trying to understand the various Allie and Jeanty Q&A's:
* In the comics we see Twangel cheering on the anti-Slayer crowd, urging his followers to find stuff to turn people against Slayers, turning up the heat on the persecution of Slayers, and Twangel announcing that he had to do these things in order 'to bring Buffy low' ( to get her super-special super powers), so he beat Satsu and plays 'general on the sidelines' figure at the 'epic' battle that kills hundreds of Slayers.
* Then we get the about-face and are told that Twangel hasn't actually harmed anyone. He's been trying to help (squints really had to see how. Still have nothing. We just need to take on faith that without his invisible interference things would have been worse than they are and worse than the unknown alternative... that we also didn't see.)
Angel didn't know anything. He didn't do anything. And anything he did do or it looks like he did, he's not actually responsible forexcept for the 'helping' stuff that we didn't see. But he's gonna feel really bad about... something (not that he did anything, knew anything, or was actually responsible for anything) so feel really bad for the guy, okay?
Great character arc, huh.
So, I'm trying to understand the various Allie and Jeanty Q&A's:
* In the comics we see Twangel cheering on the anti-Slayer crowd, urging his followers to find stuff to turn people against Slayers, turning up the heat on the persecution of Slayers, and Twangel announcing that he had to do these things in order 'to bring Buffy low' ( to get her super-special super powers), so he beat Satsu and plays 'general on the sidelines' figure at the 'epic' battle that kills hundreds of Slayers.
* Then we get the about-face and are told that Twangel hasn't actually harmed anyone. He's been trying to help (squints really had to see how. Still have nothing. We just need to take on faith that without his invisible interference things would have been worse than they are and worse than the unknown alternative... that we also didn't see.)
* But we still had that Twangel had to don the mask to 'bring her low' [though apparently, according to the Q&A and Twangle's 'explanation,' he actually didn't do anything to accomplish that goal and was secretly 'helping' -- in direct opposition to his stated goal (and even though we never see him helping the slayers) ] in order to bring about Twilight.
* Except now Jeanty tells us that Twangel didn't know that Twilight meant space-frakking or the death of the world or... well, let's see....
Looks like Angel basically didn't know anything-- not what Twilight was, how it was activated, what it involved, what it meant, or what it did (nothing wrong with volunteering for a mission like that!). He did, however, know that it was 'better' than the alternative (whatever that was). So, um... he 'knew' the alternative was 'worse' than the Twilight that he had no understanding of ... because a talking dog told him so. Makes perfect sense, right? Who couldn't be persuaded by that? He's not stupid at all! And besides, he didn't actually do anythingexcept the helping stuff that we didn't see.
* So in pursuing the creation of the Twilight [that he didn't know what it was but had decided to 'bring about' by doing ... something (though we're not entirely sure what... which is okay because he had no idea what it would be either) ]
Well, anyway, after he did or didn't do whatever it was he thought he needed to do (but he didn't know what he actually needed to do) to bring about Twilight (whatever he thought that might be), we -- and he -- see that it's destroying the world. So how does he react? Twangel wants to stay in his special world even though he can see that it's bringing about the end of the world. He even gives the circular logic of the present universe being replaced, but Scoobs, who are in the world that is being replaced, would be okay... somehow. In the dead, replaced world that's coming apart at the seams.
* Except now Jeanty tells us that Twangel didn't know that Twilight meant space-frakking or the death of the world or... well, let's see....
Looks like Angel basically didn't know anything-- not what Twilight was, how it was activated, what it involved, what it meant, or what it did (nothing wrong with volunteering for a mission like that!). He did, however, know that it was 'better' than the alternative (whatever that was). So, um... he 'knew' the alternative was 'worse' than the Twilight that he had no understanding of ... because a talking dog told him so. Makes perfect sense, right? Who couldn't be persuaded by that? He's not stupid at all! And besides, he didn't actually do anything
* So in pursuing the creation of the Twilight [that he didn't know what it was but had decided to 'bring about' by doing ... something (though we're not entirely sure what... which is okay because he had no idea what it would be either) ]
Well, anyway, after he did or didn't do whatever it was he thought he needed to do (but he didn't know what he actually needed to do) to bring about Twilight (whatever he thought that might be), we -- and he -- see that it's destroying the world. So how does he react? Twangel wants to stay in his special world even though he can see that it's bringing about the end of the world. He even gives the circular logic of the present universe being replaced, but Scoobs, who are in the world that is being replaced, would be okay... somehow. In the dead, replaced world that's coming apart at the seams.
Makes perfect sense, right? ( Huh? )
* And it's only because Buffy was going back to the world, leaving him in Twilight alone, that Angel decided to go back to the world that was being destroyed, that he didn't seem particularly bothered by it being destroyed (because he wasn't willing to help it until Buffy made him do it) but apparently -- we're now told -- he had no idea was going to be destroyed (other than his standing there witnessing its destruction and not caring very much). In summary, he didn't actually know what 'bringing about Twilight' actually meant, so he didn't actually intend any of what he did (whatever that was that we're still not clear about). And he did it just 'cause a talking dog told him to.
* Then we get Twangel being taken over by Twilight so we can be extra doubly sure that he's really, most sincerely not in control over what he does at the end...even though he's not responsible for any of the rest of it either.
So, let me sum up Twangel's 'character arc' of Season 8:Angel didn't know anything. He didn't do anything. And anything he did do or it looks like he did, he's not actually responsible for
Great character arc, huh.
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no subject
Date: 2010-12-14 01:55 am (UTC)Albeit nothing in the actual plot made that clear.
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Date: 2010-12-14 03:59 am (UTC)Not to mention that she breaks it to avoid utter annihilation of said world and its future. No matter which way you look at it, it makes no sense.
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Date: 2010-12-14 04:36 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2010-12-15 12:25 am (UTC)I kinda figured the betrayal would involved people betraying other people.
Where's a "curse your sudden by inevitable betrayal" icon when you need one?
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Date: 2010-12-15 03:16 am (UTC)Betray. Betray. What? You want explanations that make sense? You're reading the wrong comic. [/snark] :D
no subject
Date: 2010-12-15 07:01 pm (UTC)Liar! ;)
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Date: 2010-12-15 04:55 pm (UTC)I don't have an icon, but I did make this... >:)
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Date: 2010-12-15 06:59 pm (UTC)The thing you made is by far the best, most coherent explanation of S8 so far.
Also, unrelated: do we know each other? It seems like we should know each other. Sparklies? CDS? O_o
no subject
Date: 2010-12-15 07:15 pm (UTC)Busy day. Can barely correct my own typos! *g*
The thing you made is by far the best, most coherent explanation of S8 so far.
Thank you. And honestly, I don't think it's too far from the truth - Joss is quite simply playing with his toys for his own amusement.
Also, unrelated: do we know each other? It seems like we should know each other. Sparklies? CDS? O_o
Hmmm. I'm pretty LJ-centric, but we've probably got lots of friends in common...